She applied to her dream company 77 times. She walked downtown, found the founder, introduced herself, and got in on audacity alone. She became a President's Club banker, the face of the company's internal empowerment campaign, and a mentor to others navigating workplace inequities. Then she started asking questions about racial disparities in lending rates — and everything changed. Zara Northover is a 2008 Jamaican Olympian, TEDx speaker, entrepreneur, author, and pro se litigant before the United States Supreme Court. When her career was stripped away after she spoke up about workplace inequities — punctuated by a gorilla birthday card sent by company leadership — she refused to go quietly. She fired her attorney rather than accept a settlement that would have silenced her. She taught herself the law. She filed her own briefs. She was granted an oral hearing. And she's still fighting. In this episode, Zara talks about growing up the daughter of Jamaican immigrants, blazing trails as a female Jamaican shot putter, the moment she chose to fight instead of settle, and how AI became an unlikely weapon in her legal arsenal. She also shares what keeps her going when the fight gets dark — and why she believes the resistance you meet is always a signal that elevation is coming. This one hits differently. It's meant to.
Zara Northover didn't want to be a pro se litigant before the US Supreme Court. Nobody wants that. But when her career was stripped away after she spoke up about workplace inequities — and when a gorilla birthday card arrived from company leadership two weeks after she was threatened — she made a choice: stand up, or live forever knowing she didn't.
Five years later, she's still standing.
What We Get Into
- [01:44] What pro se means — and why nobody chooses this path voluntarily
- [03:05] Daughter of immigrants — writing her mother's resume in sixth grade and learning what racism looks like before you have a word for it
- [04:29] Imposter syndrome is earned, not innate — why she believes self-doubt is something that gets installed, not built in
- [05:22] The Olympic mindset — what it takes to be delusional enough to compete for Jamaica in shot put and why that same energy carried her through the legal fight
- [08:10] 77 applications — walking downtown to find the founder, and getting in on audacity alone
- [11:11] From office pet to office threat — the moment helping others navigate workplace inequity made her the problem
- [13:04] The email that started it all — flagging racial disparities in lending rates and the meeting that followed
- [16:47] The gorilla card — a birthday card from company leadership that said everything without saying anything
- [19:55] Choosing to fight — what it looks like when you weigh the cost of staying silent against the cost of speaking up
- [21:31] The attorney problem — why having the wrong attorney is almost as bad as having none, and the moment she went pro se
- [24:14] Resistance is elevation — why she runs toward friction instead of away from it
- [28:27] AI as a legal tool — how ChatGPT, Claude, and Perplexity helped her navigate a system designed to keep non-lawyers out
- [29:48] Preseason for a lawsuit — sitting in public hearings, watching law influencers, binging Suits and Erin Brockovich
- [34:16] The human moments — breaking down in the law library, and what brought her back
- [35:00] Mirror work — the coaching practice that keeps her anchored when the fight gets heavy
About Zara Northover
Zara Northover is a 2008 Jamaican Olympian (shot put), TEDx speaker, entrepreneur, and pro se litigant before the United States Supreme Court. She is the founder of Legal Aviators, an AI-powered platform helping everyday people navigate the legal system, and she relaunched Moving in Faith, a purpose-driven brand rooted in courage and resilience. Her forthcoming book, The Cost of Justice in the Midst of the Storm, was written from inside the storm itself. She is a daughter of Jamaican immigrants, a former President's Club banker, and one of the most quietly defiant people you will ever hear.
Resources & Organizations Mentioned
Connect with The Imposter Roster
The Imposter Roster (00:00)
Just about every adult, female or male, has faced some type of adversity in the workplace. I know this from personal experience. It's not easy to stand up for oneself. We don't want to rock the boat, or we question if somehow we precipitated the wrongful behavior. Zara Northover didn't question herself. She chose to stand up for herself. Zara is a pro se litigant before the US Supreme Court who has been navigating the American legal system for more than five years.
Self representative, self taught, and still standing. When the career she spent nearly a decade building was stripped away after she spoke up about workplace inequities, Zara refused to let the fight consume her identity. I'd like to add that Ms. Northover is a 2008 Jamaican Olympian, TEDx speaker, entrepreneur, and an author. She founded Legal Aviators an AI powered platform helping everyday people navigate the legal system and she relaunched Moving in Faith, a purpose-driven brand rooted in courage and resilience. Her forthcoming book, The Cost of Justice in the Midst of the Storm, was written from inside the storm itself. Please join me in welcoming Ms. Zara Northover. Welcome Zara. I am so grateful
that you found time because I heard your schedule. your schedule
Okay. Can we start can we start
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (01:36)
Ha ha ha ha.
The Imposter Roster (01:39)
out with this? What exactly is pro se
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (01:44)
So, first of all, thank you for having me. This is I'm always excited to be able to talk about this topic because it's important. Like I do believe that our people perish for lack of knowledge. So we have to share our experiences and the things that we go through, good and bad and indifferent, so people can learn. So pro se litigants means that I'm a self-representing litigant. So typically that term I think is like a Latin term in the the legal system that they use.
So in at the Supreme Court level I'm considered petitioner pro se instead of attorney.
The Imposter Roster (02:15)
Per se
okay. So can you back up because honestly there is so much written about you and with respect to I'll say it you know, strength, the strength that you have shown to state your case, but really to stand up for yourself in a way that is inconceivable, but you know, really by someone like myself and maybe many others.
You've been up against a very, very big I'll say Goliath. And if you could give the listening audience a a general background of what is it that got you to this point where you are a pro se litigator in the US Supreme Court and what how significant
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (03:03)
Absolutely.
The Imposter Roster (03:04)
that is actually.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (03:05)
Thank you. And thank you for giving me the space. It's nobody wants to be here. You know, I I didn't want to be a pro se litigant. I didn't want to be before the Supreme Court. I didn't want to be retaliated or discriminated against. You know, and you know, as as people in general, because workplace bullying is across the board. It doesn't matter what your gen you it could be age,
The Imposter Roster (03:24)
Yeah. Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (03:26)
it could be race, it could be you know, like gender, all the things. Like if you're targeted, you're targeted and nobody deserves that. that's one thing that I do believe
I have always been an individual that was self-motivated. And you know, it it comes from I am a daughter of an immigrant, right? Like of two immigrants. Like both my parents are Jamaican. God rest my dad's soul, right? It but my mom, you know, came came to the States, worked her way up, and you know, she's a citizen now. But I remember the days of being in sixth grade and having to write her resume, right? Because she didn't have
a high school or college degree. She didn't necessarily understand the system. And you know, in sixth grade you're just kind of starting to learn and type and do all those things. And, you know, I think it was my first real encounter of understanding even what racism and bias and all those things could be. Like not quite understanding, but just my mom saying, Hey, I'm gonna need you to call this apartment complex. I'm gonna tell you what to say because she has a Jamaican accent and I didn't.
The Imposter Roster (04:28)
Yes.
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (04:29)
You know, so
so there were th those types of things. So I think when I look back on my career and just even who I am as a person, there's no way that I wasn't gonna be an advocate 'cause I've had to I mean I've been an advocate since a child. And so you know, I I'm grateful for that experience, but I've also learned how heavy that can be. And it's one of the things that allowed me to realize that I don't think anyone really and truly is
Don't believe in themselves, right? Like, you know, like when we talk about imposter syndrome and we talk about all those things, you don't initially have it. I think it's something that you almost gain because you get turned down, you get rejected. Somebody tells you that you're not good enough. Somebody tells you that you gotta keep working hard or maybe you'll get it. And then you start to internalize it when you don't see the results right away.
that see you have to be kind of delusional to go to the Olympics, right? Like you know that it's only so for me
The Imposter Roster (05:20)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (05:22)
it was like, I'm gonna make it like and I know I'm good enough and I don't care if it's gonna take me four years, eight years, like you know, I just had a plan and it was internal because I just knew I had I had it in me. Like, you know, and I think that can break. Like, you know, I c there were moments I did question myself, but I also realized that it was only when someone else was attacking me.
Right. So when you look at being attacked because of what somebody says you can't do, you you're girl, you only five four, you're not gonna make that team. Girl, you compete for Jamaica. They only have runners, like like like that you know
The Imposter Roster (05:58)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (05:58)
you're only known for sprinters and and you're not you saying bolts, right? Like you know, like you get a lot of comments like that, so then you wonder. But then I'm like, But what if I'm not what if I'm the first? What if I'm gonna blaze the trail? What if like
The Imposter Roster (06:10)
What was your
what was your event then in Olympics?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (06:13)
I was a shot putter,
so I threw the big old iron ball as far as you can. so
The Imposter Roster (06:18)
did shot put in eighth grade. not
Olympic version, but I I did shot put in eighth grade.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (06:23)
well that's cool. Sometimes
in the beginning when I would talk about it they were like, like the lady from Matilda and I'm like Yep, that's me.
The Imposter Roster (06:34)
Guilty How cool is that though? Yeah, you're
right. I mean, let's be honest. I mean, shot put female Jamaican here you are.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (06:47)
And now
and now we have a a a few I mean, I'm so proud of her. Daniel Dodd is a female shop putter that's made it to the Olympics. That's you know, and she's honestly one of the top shot putters in the world. So you know, so I wasn't necessarily the person and this is why I share that story because it emulates the legal journey too. I wasn't the person, yes, that won at the Olympics, but I was the person that blazed the trail so people could see it was possible.
That there is a future in this, that shop printers can be cool too.
And that it was a
The Imposter Roster (07:17)
I say you are.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (07:18)
thing. So now the so many more got into it, and now we have people that are at the top, you know, considered at the top with some of the most elite across the world. So that is the same thing that happens when it comes to dealing with workplace bullying or harassment or discrimination or retaliation. It's unfortunate because the first person that might have said something may get ignored, right? Like the first person that files the complaint.
it r may not even go anywhere. But that complaint now sets the trail and the trend and documentation that when the next person files a complaint and the next person files a complaint and the next person files a complaint, eventually something gets done. And so that's the decision I had to make when here I am I worked really hard to get into my company. Honestly, I moved to Detroit all I knew about Detroit was eight mile and MM, right? Like you know, like when I first
The Imposter Roster (08:09)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (08:10)
got to this the city.
And when I got to Michigan, but I loved the culture, I love the grit, I love the grind, and all I kept saying, you know, seeing was this certain company everywhere. So I was like, that's where I want to be. I applied 77 times. Same 77
The Imposter Roster (08:23)
To that same company?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (08:25)
times. It wasn't until a friend said that you know the CEOs downtown, the own founders downtown, so I got dressed, went downtown.
And I went chasing and I was like, my name is Zara, and I've been applying to your company. Talk about audacity, right? I've been applying to your company over, over, over again. And then, you know, the CEO looks at me and says, You are the exact energy we need. Like, you know, and eventually that
The Imposter Roster (08:47)
Wait, wait, wait, wait, you spoke to the CEO?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (08:49)
the founder, yep, absolutely. I I I I am not, I am the person that said that that if you give out the number and says
You know, nobody really ever calls me I'm gonna be the one that's like toot toot toot Because you my
The Imposter Roster (09:05)
Where are you?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (09:07)
mom always taught me that whether somebody's a janitor or the CEO, they're still human.
The Imposter Roster (09:13)
Yeah. Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (09:15)
They're still human. To be honest, and I remember hearing hearing him speak and s and and he said, like, you know, it gets lonely at the top because people get afraid to call you. So pe you know, so me reaching out half the time wasn't even necessarily about work. It was like, just want to say thank you for the opportunity. Thank you for creating the place that's a you know, afforded us all a job, right? Like, you know, like because it does get lonely at the top. And you know, I can say even from a s the celebrity status of
When you're in the Olympics and you're traveling and you're training, you're missing birthdays, you're missing weddings, you're missing a lot of different things for for the sacrifice to try to make a team. And so it it can be a very lonely road. It can be, but you also know that there's a greater purpose. Like, you know, there's a purpose and there was something innate in you. There's a calling that you're answering.
The Imposter Roster (10:05)
So y so you applied seventy seven times, you actually got in and
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (10:08)
Eventually got in and I came in
The Imposter Roster (10:11)
you met the CEO.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (10:12)
I had the CEO before I even got in.
The Imposter Roster (10:15)
Before
you even got in. What in the what what happened? What happened that got
yeah, how did we get here?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (10:20)
we get here. Yeah, so I came
in and then I was like, okay, well now I gotta prove myself. So remember everything I do is like athletic mindset. So it's like, okay, I'm gonna be the best at and pass these tests the first try. I'm gonna be the MVP. So now you have this, you know, it's an industry that's normally male dominated. Normally, you know, and if you do, it's it's not as many African American you know, African American women. So I actually got, you know, graduated and elevated, promoted throughout the process very quickly.
became a president's club banker and and I ended up writing the company my first year and and sharing that story, like after winning some awards, because I truly believe in the importance of talking about your experience. And I remember one of the CEOs at the time wrote back and said 77 times because they didn't know the story, right? Like, you know, and then the
The Imposter Roster (11:11)
Right.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (11:11)
company did a documentary on me.
And and you know and use that to inspire and empower people. So now I'm speaking to over thousand you know, 30,000 team members from across the nation, encouraging and empowering people. So now you wonder, well, how are you here though? Because I
The Imposter Roster (11:27)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (11:27)
always tell people, you know, you end up with that one manager, right? What like the person that doesn't know you, that didn't want to pay attention to the video, right? Like, or you
The Imposter Roster (11:37)
Ha ha ha ha.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (11:38)
you know, like there was a study I remember hearing, it was like from office pet to office threat.
Alright, in the beginning I was the girl that, like, we could use her to do this, we could use her to do that. But now it's like, she has a question? She's asking us about injustices. She's like because what happens when you put somebody in position to lead and to mentor, then you start to hear issues that other people are going through. And then you have to now say, Well, you need to go to HR. You need to speak up to yourself. You need to bring that before someone. So before it was even a my issue.
It was a other people coming. Well, how did you navigate? Because I'm dealing with harassment or I'm dealing with this. And now that is a lot to unload when you're like, what? Because you're not dealing with it. I wasn't dealing with it at the you know at that time. So,
The Imposter Roster (12:24)
Mm-hmm.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (12:24)
but I'm an advocate, right? Like I always stood up for people. I was the president of my class. I was the captain of the team. So I don't want anybody to have a bad experience. So I, you know, I explained, you gotta go through the process. Cause what are we taught in school?
Go to HR if something bad happens to you at work. When I
The Imposter Roster (12:41)
Yes,
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (12:42)
tell people now, you know, no, call your mentor at another business, right? Like, or reach out to an employment attorney because it's free consultations. So you could articulate what's happening. You could get the feedback of what you need to say when you go to HR. So, like, so prepare yourself because the HR is there to protect the company, not you, right? Like, you know, and so it is a step
The Imposter Roster (13:03)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (13:04)
that you have to take, but
So so ultimately that's what ended up happening. So let's fast forward to from twenty fourteen now to twenty twenty. And that's around the time of COVID, around George Floyd, around all the things. And that's where things started to hit the fan. Because you have town halls and people are saying we want to see more diversity and leadership. You have people kind of chanting different things and
and I'm
The Imposter Roster (13:26)
Yeah, yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (13:27)
a fixer.
Like, you know, I loved what I was doing. I loved where I was at work. So I was like, I think, you know, I remember the the chief revenue officer reaching out and saying, What would you do if I was if you were me? So I answered that question. No, you know, and I said, This is what I would do. I'd create a pipeline for diversity. I have tons of talented friends. So I actually started referring people myself. And then what happened was that's when I started to see the inconsistencies in the system. I'm like, wait, I referred Christina and like she just said she didn't get a call in seven days. Is it seven days we're gonna call her? Is it
Two weeks are we gonna call her? Like, what's the process? So, but you know, once you start typing, once you're like per the conversation, what is the process? Now they're like, wait, are you it's not that the systems are process, you're the problem, right? Like they're that's that's what and it's interesting
The Imposter Roster (14:12)
Mm-hmm.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (14:13)
to me because there was a article about Nike the other day where they were saying like they could have fixed the issue, but they chose to fix the person and they had to F around and find out. Like so because like it ended up being a lawsuit.
And I think that even when I look at this situation, you know, here I am saying, like, we have talented people that we're dropping the ball on, just not even giving them a fair chance, right? Like, so this is just something that we should fix. So that was the first issue. And then now we we fast forward into COVID space, and then I'm on a task force team, the the Black Wealth Gap Committee or the Wealth Gap Committee, however, they change the name often. And that's when I looked up in the Urban Institute says African Americans have a higher percent interest rate than.
everybody else. So then I was like, well I remember when I was a banker that we had increased the rates for FHA. So in my head I was like, well we could unintentionally be adding to this racial divide, right? Like so just doing my job. Like not thinking it's like,
The Imposter Roster (15:07)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (15:08)
you know, it's one of those like, well, you know, maybe we could unintentionally be doing this, so let's we could fix it. Right. Like that's the naivety like of just how I was at that time.
So I reached out and I sent the email. Or like so, and then that's when legal and everybody's like coming at me. And then I I find myself being called into a meeting where I'm thinking I'm talking about the future of purchase and it's the I'm looking at the head of HR and the chief risk officer. And then before I know it, I'm being told if I continue down this path, it won't end well for me. My leader's not there, my person for HR is not there. I'm like, wait, what path are we talking about? Like
The Imposter Roster (15:46)
I
was gonna say dif did they define what this path is?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (15:49)
The the path came
because after I called out what I just expressed about the rates and and everything else. You know, they brought up in November the time
The Imposter Roster (15:53)
Right. And that's the path to which they were referring. Okay.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (15:57)
frame when I talked about like the diversity and and issues. So, you know, the of course they're not gonna like detailed say this is what it is, but when those things happen and it was after the the the rates conver conversation, that's when that's what we're talking about Northover. We as a company decide to raise rates and that's what we're gonna do and if you continue down this path.
It
won't end well for you. You know, like I always tell people, you remember something almost verbatim when it's when it's one harsh and unexpected. And then it was one of those fight or flight, right? At that point. So I was just like, okay, I'm gonna hold myself together in this call. But you know, of course I after I got off that call, I'm like messaging on the side because it's a Teams, I'm reaching out to HR, my person that I speak to in HR typically, I'm reaching out to my leader. I'm like, what's happening? Like I thought I was supposed to be talking about like
future stuff. So this was an uncalled meeting
The Imposter Roster (16:46)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (16:47)
with other people that are in this meeting that weren't on the calendar. It was not what it was supposed to be. And that's when I knew something obviously was up. But what made it worse was two weeks later my birthday comes around and I'm gonna preface this by saying I'm the girl at the company that was like, thank you so much for the card. Even though you know like you may not whether it was a generic card or whatever, I just like I'm that person. I got a card in the mail with a gorilla a gorilla on the front.
And dressed up as a fortune teller holding a card and inside the c inside the the card said, I see a great year in your future or bananas. It's unclear. Happy birthday anyway. Signed the former CEO and former COO.
The Imposter Roster (17:30)
Of the company.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (17:31)
Company.
So I'm sitting here now, like remember, I was just threatened. If you continue down this path, it will end well for you. And now I'm getting a gorilla birthday card as a black woman that says, I see a great year in your future or bananas. So like I see something good or crazy. So it's like it's almost saying you decide, like, right? Like, are you gonna fall in line? Like, you know, and and
The Imposter Roster (17:49)
Well I would they run out of horse heads to put in your bed or something? I mean what? I mean
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (17:54)
so I had panic attacks. Like, you know, like I
The Imposter Roster (17:57)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (17:57)
It was it was you know of course I filed the complaint and then the you know the the the blanket issued statement of like we apologize and we're gonna find a more diverse supplier and like you know get sent out and and I just the pa between the panic attacks and being taken out on leave, I remember going to church one day and there was a pass a sign behind my pastor that said bigger than me. And I had to acqu I question myself, I said
One, I know I didn't deserve this, you know, and then obviously you start showing people the card and the picture and all that stuff, and they're like, absolutely not. Right? Like, you know, like they're like guns, like you're better than me, right? Like, you know, like you start getting those types of comments. but it was also just like this was a company I fought so hard to get
The Imposter Roster (18:40)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (18:40)
into. I had hundreds of reviews from pee positive reviews from people, never had issues. My face, my likeness, everything was being used. So there is also that hurt.
Right? Like there this is this is on another level. Like, you know, and
The Imposter Roster (18:53)
Yeah, totally.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (18:55)
so I I realized though, what do I look like if I don't stand up for myself? What what message is that saying? I was a face of empowerment, of engagement, of you know, advocacy, and now it's happening to me. So I I told myself, like, you know, as a friend that said you could either do something about it, you say nothing, and you keep moving, but that's gonna live with you forever, right? Like that feeling, it's gonna eat at you internally.
I understand
now why
The Imposter Roster (19:19)
It's
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (19:19)
people talk about they c you know committed suicide or they you went into depression or any of those things. And then if I do something about it, you also know it's gonna be an uphill battle because this is a multi-billion dollar company, right? Like in I'm not I don't have a multi-billion dollar bank account, right? So I prayed about it and then you know I tried to go through the EEOC, couldn't get an appointment, and then you know, friend was like, like I I know an attorney and
Please, if anybody's ever in a situation like this, make sure you get the right attorney. Cause if you don't have the right type of employment attorney, it's not gonna be good for you. And there's people out there that are looking to try to get a quick settlement, not necessarily justice. Like you just wanna make sure
The Imposter Roster (19:57)
Right.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (19:58)
you are aligned. And these are all the things I did not know, right? Like, you know, in the beginning, because this is not taught.
The Imposter Roster (20:03)
You have no choice
but to trust. I mean, they're the attorney and you've come to them for assistance, you've told them your story, what's not to trust, right?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (20:12)
So
so going through that process, that's what made me you know, I'm I'm I'm are I was already a motivating motivational speaker before I came to the company, right? Like I that's who I have been my whole life. So I'm notating mentally like all these things that are happening while they're happening, but I'm also going through it emotionally, like right, and and trying to give myself grace. So luck luckily I am spiritually grounded. So that was a thing I found solace in, right? Like in in prayer and but but it it's it was hard.
It was very hard because now you're being gaslit by potentially attorneys. You're being, you know, like you're wondering, sh do I still go? Do I not go? Like, how does this work? This they told me I needed to find another attorney. So I found another attorney and then thought he was great. And then he wasn't even calling back other people that were impacted. The same guy that said, the same man that said, I had to you know, you if you continue down this path it won't end well for you. I'm getting a call from someone else where they're like
He told me it to muzzle me like a dog, muzzle me like a dog in front of my sub you know, subordinates. This is a VP that reached out to me. Because now I'm also getting calls from other people. Cause once I decided to take this further legal action, now I you know, there are people that are dealing with stuff themselves, so they're like watching me, right? Like, you know, they're watching to see what happens. So they're they're seeing, like, okay,
The Imposter Roster (21:27)
I was gonna say they're looking to you as the light. They're looking to you as the light.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (21:31)
well, we'll see what happens with her first, right? Like, like, you know, and it's and it's like I could, I could I'm
stoic through this now because it's been years right of of this battle. So I had an attorney basically for the first I would say like close to three years of this. And then here I thought that the briefs are done, all the things are done, and all of a sudden he was like, well if you don't take this offer, I'm not gonna represent you anymore. And I'm like, but I'm not I can't sell up my silence. I can't like you want me to not talk about 10 years of my life? And I had to I made a stance when this when I first saw the bigger than me, I knew that we have to end the cycle
Of suffering in silence. We have to normalize that we are worthy, that what happened to us doesn't define where we go from here. And it shouldn't. It shouldn't be something that I feel shame about because I didn't do it to myself. I had to survive it. I had to thrive through it. Right? So I've always been let me turn these lemons into lemonade. You
know it.
The Imposter Roster (22:28)
That you know what? You know,
you're writing I know you're writing a book. I hope that's in there because that is I I cannot tell you how critical that point is. I know this from my own experiences out there and I know many others that idea of just like I said in your intro, did I do something to precipitate this? You can't help but second guess and say, Well maybe what 'cause you're more likely to say, Well
They must know more than I do, but you didn't do that, but a lot of us do and the fact that you you point out we're not bad because we experienced it. We we didn't call it to us, it happened or we were the short stick drawing person, you know. I mean it's it it's what happened, but that doesn't define us, doesn't define who we are.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (23:18)
Absolutely. I mean, you have
been a trailblazer in AI, right? Like, you know, before AI has become a a public thing. Like, so I know that couldn't even mean it like that. But, you
The Imposter Roster (23:25)
Great. Let's point out my age. Thank you, Zara.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (23:30)
know, t even the tech space, like the tech space is
The Imposter Roster (23:32)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (23:33)
typically male dominated. So I already know. Like, like, you know, like
The Imposter Roster (23:36)
Yeah it is.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (23:38)
you know, like you have been a trailblazer in that space. So I mean, even you creating this platform to help others, like, you know, where where there's resistance, it's usually because that's where the need is.
You know, so even in yourself, like that's how like I push
The Imposter Roster (23:50)
Yes.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (23:51)
forward. If there is resistance with me like trying to go for the next level or doing stuff, that's where I'm supposed to go. Because the resistance means that you're getting ready for elevation. I like to think of it like it was I remember listening to a sermon where they talked about the the takeoff for a plane, right? Like, so if you don't have resistance, that plane's not going anywhere, right?
The Imposter Roster (24:13)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (24:14)
So it's like you're going, you're going, you're going, and you're gonna meet the resistance. But if you wanna rise higher, then you have to go head on. Like, you know, and I
The Imposter Roster (24:22)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (24:22)
think that's what I internalized through this process. So I knew the name calling was gonna come. I knew the reframing was gonna come, but you also I also knew I have a Wikipedia page. you could Google me and see all the who I am as a person beyond this company. So so the reality is
The Imposter Roster (24:38)
Yes.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (24:39)
What
I'm not gonna do is allow them to create the narrative and that is the reason why I did that TED talk. We are worth the cost of justice. And because I said, you know what, it's and I was nervous when I tell you because my heart was pounding, I made sure I had the the the card in the in the video, like you know, on the screen at some point, because I want to normalize talking about this so people could take action.
So people could, you know, not everybody's gonna take it all the way to the US Supreme Court, but everybody at least could file the complaint, get the severance, and then move on to their next job, right? Get what you deserve for the i the i issue or the thing that you had to deal with. Because most people just don't even know the process of like, no, yeah, you could totally go to the EEOC, you could totally, you know, reach back out and say this was wrong, these are the things, and this is what we need to do in order to amicably move forward, right? Like everyone's story is not gonna be the same, but every complaint should
go
in, right? So therefore you advocate for yourself, you move on and you move up. But I think, you know, re blackballing is a thing. Like like, you know, where it's like if you're in a c in a company that owns a lot of companies or affiliated with a lot of programs. So, you know, had navigating that world was tough. So but it was also inspiring, right? Because in the sense that I woke because I went public and I was finally truly obedient with putting my story out there. You know, I woke up and then like
Had some orders for moving in faith, right? Like, you know, because I've always had the website, it just kinda was dormant with everything that was going on in my life. Like, and
The Imposter Roster (26:06)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (26:07)
and then my I remember my mom saying, She was like, You have a brand called Movin' in Faith. She She was like, She was like, You don't think you're gonna get tested? You know, now say it with a Jamaican accent, right? You don't think you're gonna get tested? So, you
The Imposter Roster (26:19)
Yeah. Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (26:21)
know, and then she's like, My data is a faita. Like, you know, so
Yeah. So I knew that like this was gonna be a journey and thank thankfully I have you know, a a a s a support system, some core friends and and
The Imposter Roster (26:36)
Yeah, I was gonna say yes.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (26:37)
family that were were in it with me. I know there were moments where they're like, Z, just just keep it moving, but they they they they weren't gonna they weren't gonna tell me that because I think people failed to realize the psychological impact of not sometimes just not finishing what you started or knowing you didn't try your all.
And that's really what this comes down to for me. I tell them it's not about money. Like honestly, I think the rem last settlement, I was like, you know, it's not if you came with some crazy number right now, I still would question selling settling because I know the impact of how far I've come to be before the US Supreme Court. This is the type of law that could change the game for other people if it passes.
The Imposter Roster (27:16)
There's th you can't really put a dollar amount on what this is setting up. You really can't because how do you great, so you get a bag of money. How about all the people that follow your lead and what they actually would gain if you continue and what they would lose if you did not, right?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (27:39)
Correct. And and and
I'm glad you say that because you really touch on a point. So every time, like, so what ultimately the reason why I'm before the Supreme Court is because my case was dismissed before even I could show evidence, right? Like, you know, so it was it was dismissed early. And the I still had the complaints and I ble and I knew my lawyer at the time, my attorney said, like, no, this is wrong. We're gonna appeal this, we're gonna so he started that process, you know.
Was it because they were hoping to just get another offer and then be done? Possibly because why what happened? We got the offer and then it was like if you don't take this, I'm not gonna represent you anymore. But here I'm thinking, I'm just gonna wait to get a response, right? Like like what we could win, right? Like so I don't give an athlete a possibility, right? 'Cause even if it's
The Imposter Roster (28:22)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (28:23)
one percent, I'm thinking like, Well, you never know. Right? Like so
The Imposter Roster (28:26)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (28:27)
so
So that's what I thought. So then when he said he withdrew, and I I was like, I was just thinking, okay, well, I I'll wait for the response. Did nothing was done. So I had to follow a motion. My first motion was a motion to extend the time. Thankfully that was granted. But if it wasn't for AI, if it wasn't for the chat GBT, the claw, the the perplexity, the all the things to navigate.
The Imposter Roster (28:48)
You're welcome.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (28:51)
To navigate the understanding. And you know, I have to I give a shout out to University of Detroit Mercy Law Library because they have a designated space for pro se litigants to like use West Law, things that you wouldn't have access to if you're not an attorney to be able to fact check everything. Because you know the the AI will hallucinate.
The Imposter Roster (29:08)
god, yeah. It will but I just have
to say I know this is a this is about you. However,
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (29:13)
Yeah.
The Imposter Roster (29:14)
I have to say I'm so glad that you are showing how useful AI has been to you. This is a battle I seriously cannot even envision and you're doing it and
It's with the help of AI to get you where you need to be. You already have the hood spa. That's that's not the problem. It's the verbiage, it's the process, it's the stuff that you didn't know that you've gotta follow. So I just wanna say thank you very much.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (29:38)
Correct. Absolutely. Thank you. Like it's it's
and it was also then now I it was like, okay, we're in this fight, we're in this game.
The Imposter Roster (29:47)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (29:48)
And one of the models I've always had in Express was you have to have patience in pr in the process for longevity in the game. So I knew now it's strategy. Like if I was an athlete, what would preseason look like? What would this look like? So now I'm sitting in the courtrooms at the public hearings because it's public.
So I'm learning how the attorneys are speaking. I'm watching it, like CS YouTube became CSI for me, right? Like, you know, and
The Imposter Roster (30:10)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (30:11)
then if I was binging, I'm watching suits. I'm watching Esquire. I'm watching, you know, Aaron Brockovich, right? Like I'm watching all the legal movies I possibly can to just retain what's being said and look up to see, like, is this real or is this not real, right? Like, but that's where it's like useful binging, right? If I if I felt like I was
The Imposter Roster (30:30)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (30:30)
I was like, well, let me at least procrastinate watching something that I could learn from. So all those things helped. Like, you know, and in my book, I actually have what's called the Justice Library. And I talk about like, because most people would feel bad about like those moments where you're depressed or you're you're binging. And I'm like, well, let's turn those bad moments into productive binging moments, right? And here's the things
The Imposter Roster (30:50)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (30:51)
that I watched when I was going through this. Here's the books that I read when I or the podcasts I listened to. Because
Those are our gold. And like, you know, most people aren't gonna tell you to go do those things. They're not. But most people also don't talk about the process. And if somebody shared with me what I would need to do, maybe I would have thought differently. Or maybe I would have at least knew how to navigate. So that's why we're building legal aviators, right? Like we're building this justice aviation system in order to be able to help la navigate people through the process and learn all the things I wish I would have known from the beginning.
If you have it's and it's not, it's like if there's a lawyer, like there's a lawyer track where the the lawyer gets matched to the person, the right lawyer, right? A vetted lawyer.
The Imposter Roster (31:32)
Right.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (31:32)
And and then there's also the how do you be a good client? Because you but you don't know the process. You've never sued before, so you're like you you're panicked all the time. You're probably stressing them out and they're not your therapist, right? Like so there's
The Imposter Roster (31:44)
Yeah?
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (31:45)
there's this navigation even for you if that's the track that you're on. But if you don't get connected to a lawyer, now it's saying, hey.
This is gonna be a fight, but we're in it with you, right? Like, you know, and now it's saying this is the template. You're gonna have to file the EEOC. You only have a hundred days left, right? So it's navigating you through the process. All the things that I kinda had to fly out, find out on the fly. I had to go to the
The Imposter Roster (32:06)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (32:06)
courthouse every day to ask questions. Like, thank God some of these clerks were just really nice, right? Because every day I would be in there like, what does this mean? Like, like, like
Are are you sure you got it? Like like d is it does it look right? And they're like, We're not lawyers, like right, like you know, but all I could do it was position myself. I remember the security guard the day of my oral hearing though, 'cause I I was granted oral hearing. Like I was granted to speak. Like that doesn't necessarily happen because even as a pro se litigant or self representing litigant, I'm like a minority in the legal system.
The Imposter Roster (32:38)
Right.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (32:39)
Right, because most people have attorneys. So now they kind of side eye and they don't necessarily take you seriously. But I've done the things to make sure that, like, no, what you're not gonna do is say that my brief's not good because now AI is it's so advanced that it is teaching you. It's and it you have to get better at prompting and learning, but that's between now being at the law library, asking all these questions, talking to law students, doing going
The Imposter Roster (32:59)
Yeah. Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (33:01)
to watch law influencers, right? Like, you know, people that talk about this stuff and pulling it all together. So yes, it was a full time job.
Right?
Like a full-time job and like spiritually fasting and getting myself like mentally prepared because it's tough to read some of the nasty things that they write about you or the things that you're like, that's not even true, right? Like you do gotta live with that. But then I have to remind myself, they're doing their job. Their job is to protect the company, their job is to try to make me look like I'm some you know, has been
The Imposter Roster (33:30)
Mm.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (33:30)
or just doing this for whatever reason. so therefore they could try to sway a judge or sway a jury their way.
My job is to protect me. My job is to remind everybody who I am and who whose I am and what I've done and and that I am somebody and and I
The Imposter Roster (33:44)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (33:44)
deser I didn't deserve this. Like regard like I didn't deserve this. So that's where I think the chick the game changed for me because now I'm not getting emotional of what they're doing. I'm like, they really don't have anything now because now they're go they're resorting to name calling. Like now they now they now they're calling me a serial litigant, now they're saying this, they're saying that, like
The Imposter Roster (34:02)
Love it. Honest
I give you so much credit to even be able to recognize that so that you are like now you're not even getting face where both of us would just be reduced to a pile on the ground. You're like, Yeah, no, that's not gonna work on me and you just keep on.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (34:16)
But I and I
and I wanna share that I'm saying that part, but there was the moment. They I remember seeing
The Imposter Roster (34:24)
Yeah.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (34:24)
something and I'm like and I almost screamed and broke down crying in the in the library and and I and the care of the librarians that they just saw me working so hard, so they came over and hugged me, gave me some tissue, and I took a deep breath.
But then it's like that's when in the moments where you are questioned, you're human. So you are gonna have the moments. I do allow myself to feel the emotions and try to talk through them with people. But then I just remember at the core of it all, I am a strong woman and I am worthy, right? Like, and that's what I have to get back to, regardless of what I'm feeling in the moment. I have to resort back to.
One of the things my coach would make me do is look in the mirror and say, I'm great and I'm going to do great things. So even when I speak to high school kids and and different places, I usually bring up a mirror and I'm like, I want you guys to look in the mirror and say, I'm great and I'm gonna do great things. Because it's the reminder and you have to see yourself. So I can't unsee me. I can't unsee what I've done, and I've done a lot of great things, and I'm not gonna hide that anymore. Because we've been taught to be so humble and then so you're questioned the like.
Is it cocky or is it confident? Is it right? Like is am I is it humility or is it humbleness, right? Like, but it's you're just owning what you've done. That's it.
The Imposter Roster (35:36)
Honestly, I these are such empowering thoughts and words that you are saying that really are at the crux of why I even created this show because we all feel this in different levels. your strength, and this is the whole point, is to show strong women that yeah, you've had things happen and you're so close to crumbling, and then you say, I can't do that. I can't I I'm not gonna live with regret 'cause I have to live with myself, right?
I can't live with regret. So I am I am definitely going to be posting information about you because I'm sure there are people are gonna want to follow and see what what's what? I mean how this is this is really interesting to me because I'm gonna be watching you so I can feel I feel your strength and I can use it like daily and so
I I'm gonna be following you. I wanna post all of this because I think it's important that people recognize there are the lone wolves out there that are saying, All right, I'll do it on my own. Of course it takes an Olympian to do it, but you know, honestly
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (36:44)
We we we can do
it. We can do it. You don't have to be an Olympian. You can do it too.
The Imposter Roster (36:50)
Ha ha ha.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (36:51)
You know, we all have it in us. It it takes the it takes having the audacity to give yourself the shot. That's what it takes. It takes having the audacity to allow yourself to have the courage to take the first step. Just take the first step.
The Imposter Roster (37:03)
And
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (37:04)
And or slide
The Imposter Roster (37:04)
well
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (37:05)
into my DMs. I I do respond you know and and I do share this journey and and there's more of us coming out now, right? There's more pro se litigants
The Imposter Roster (37:13)
Right.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (37:14)
and there's more people that have just found the right attorney, right? Like there's more because there's more talk about it, there's there's
The Imposter Roster (37:19)
Yes.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (37:20)
more knowledge about it. So people are able to navigate better.
The Imposter Roster (37:24)
So I would have to say then that normally I would tell one, you know, you have proven that you have finally taken yourself off the roster. Let's be honest, Zara, you were never on the roster. Somebody tried to put you on there and then you looked at them and you said, Junior, can you toss a shot put No, I didn't think so. Step aside, Junior. So that being the case
I'm just gonna raise a glass to you and toast to your wins so far, your wins in the future, and our wins, because we get to observe a powerful woman pushing through a process that usually teams of people can't get through. So thank you so very much for taking time. I know right now you're in Vegas and
You're gonna be all over the place and a and I the fact that you're like, I can carve out a little bit of time, okay, I'll I'll do this podcast now, I feel honored, seriously. So
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (38:31)
And
I appreciate you for having me. you know, I'm in an integral part in this process. So by September 30th, so if there's any attorneys listening or anybody that's admitted to the Supreme Court, I would or knows anybody that works for NAACP, ACLU, NELA, any of those organizations, you know, what can help me at this point would be someone that could write what's called it an amicus brief or like a letter to say talking about retaliation or something pertaining to my question. So you could just reach out to me.
But that's part of the reason why I want to carve out. It's important for people to know the process. And I also know getting my story out, that's what allows me to potentially to also get the help that I may need. Like, you know, like to to elevate. So this is extra. Like I'm in there, I have the docket number, but if I could find somebody that will write write in an amicus, it would be a a huge win. It'd be a huge benefit.
The Imposter Roster (39:19)
Well and I can tell you anyone listening to this is gonna wanna see you win because if you win we all win and I really sincerely believe that. So from the bottom of my heart, thank you, thank you, thank you for being you. Thank you for taking time to talk to us and I sincerely wish you the best possible outcome and soon.
Zara Northover, Oly, ProSe (39:39)
Thank you.
The Imposter Roster (39:41)
All right. Thank you. And for all of you who are listening, thank you for sharing this time with Zara and myself. I'm gonna bet that there's some things that she said that really struck home with you. And there are times in your life where you just say, I I can't do this anymore. You can best believe Zara felt the same. And she said, But I have to. So keep on keeping on because that is the only way you're gonna reach that goal or that.
pinnacle that you set for yourself. When you stop, you stop. So thank you so much for listening and see you next time.